Quote:
Originally Posted by Licketysplit  Again that is just your opinion there is no concerte proof to back that up. So unless your going to come into a debate with some facts can you please get out?
I could sit here all day and just rip you in pieces without even putting any thought in it. All your statements are weak and very invalid. |
You're the one who said that the fetus is conscious. The burden of proof falls on you. To say that
we have to prove that the fetus
isn't conscious would be idiotic.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Licketysplit Sorry let me re-word that question for you so it actually makes more sense. Where are my references?
Well thank you for asking here.
At 18 days [when the mother is only four days late for her first menstrual period], and by 21 days it is pumping, through a closed circulatory system, blood whose type is different from that of the mother.
Reference:J.M. Tanner, G. R. Taylor, and the Editors of Time-Life Books, Growth, New York: Life Science Library, 1965, p.12
How early do some organs form?
The eye, ear and respiratory systems begin to form four weeks after fertilization.
Reference:K. Moore, Before We Were Born, 3rd ed., 1989, p. 278
And function?
Very early, e.g., glucagon, a blood sugar hormone, has been demonstrated in the fetal pancreas 6 weeks after fertilization, and insulin by 7 to 8.Thumbsucking has been photographed at 7 weeks after fertilization.
Reference: W. Liley, The Fetus As Personality, Fetal Therapy, 1986, p. 8-17
F. Cunningham, "Pancreas," William’s Obstet., 19th ed., 1993, p. 183-4
At what point are ALL his body systems working?
By 11 weeks.
Reference: "Life Before Birth," Life Magazine, Apr. 30, 1965, p. 13
Any more questions so I can roffle stomp you harder sir? |
1. The snippets about blood pumping, organ development and basic functions were pointless, they didn't really prove consciousness at all.
2. It would have helped if you had posted the page you got the data off of.
http://www.mainerighttolife.com/feta...ment/facts.php
3. I checked the site, and some of data (which may I add is OLD) don't seem to quite make sense. In one point it says all body systems are functioning by 11 weeks, while other points are clearly pointing out that certain body systems begin functioning at 11-12 weeks. (Unless by body systems they mean organs).
There's also one point that asks when can it swallow, which is answered to be at 11 weeks, while only 2 points before it says by 9 weeks the baby can "Squint, swallow, and move his tounge"
4. I'm not exactly sure what you were going for in this debate, but if it was to refute my point about abortion that you didn't really do it. What you did was prove that by 11 weeks all the baby's body systems are functioning.
However there are a couple of things wrong with that.
A) It does not prove that the fetus can feel any pain.
B) There is no sound proof of
when the fetus can feel pain. But most studies that state that the fetus likely can't feel pain until the third trimester.
Click Click (Article) Click (Study Summary)
C) Even if th fetus somehow feels pain earlier than that (say at the beginning of the second trimester), than your argument still doesn't do much because the gross majority of abortions take place during the mid-late first trimester.
Click Click (This one is about the UK)